Louise Gissendaner is Vice President and Director of Community Development of Fifth Third Bank, Northeastern Ohio. She's also the founder and president of Sankofa Fine Art Plus. She was honored, along with Tom Schorgl, at the Cleveland Public Theater gala in September. Cavana Faithwalker met up with her and discussed arts growth in Cleveland's East Side, African American's enthusiasm for art collecting, and Sankofa Fine Arts' evolving role in the ethnic arts community.

Let's start with arts and politics. Tell me about your interaction with Ward 8 Councilperson Sabra Pierce Scott. Ward 8 has great potential and a lot of opportunities for development, although the challenges and dollars don't always match up, it appears Sabra is looking at working closely with Sankofa and the projects slated for Ward 8. It would be great for the East Side to see the same kind of involvement that the Westside receives for community arts. Councilperson Merle Gordon assisted in putting Art House on the map with $130,000 or $170,000, It'd be great to have the same thing happen on the Eastside.

Louise Gissendaner: Sankofa Fine Arts Plus was actually started before Art House. Many of the Arts granting organizations, however, have given Art House a lot of support. When Sankofa has gone before some of those same organizations, the response was, "What? Who are you again?" It has been a challenge for Sankofa to get the same focus and attention from the funding community at large. Sabra has a lot of organizations that she supports within her constituency; she supports Famicos Foundation, Glenville Development Corporation and others. Sabra and I have talked, and I hope that in the future she'll be in a position to provide additional financial support to Sankofa. It would be great to get the funding community to take us seriously and support us, so we can do the job we know we can do in the area of ethnic fine art for this community.

We could not have made it to where we are today without the continued support of Tri-C East [Cuyahoga County College, Eastern Campus]. Dr. Jerry Sue Thornton, Larry Simpson, Kathryn Hall and others believed in us and gave us an unbelievable amount of support. The United Black Fund has also been instrumental as well in helping us to thrive. Ruby Terry and UBF understand the need for an organization that increases arts and culture awareness within predominantly ethnic communities as well as providing the needed resources for local artists that have not traditionally been accepted in mainstream art venues.

I found volumes about you and your extensive background with Glenville Development Corporation, The Urban League, The County Charter Review Commission (and I know there was no glory in doin' that!) as well as the East Akron Neighborhood Development Corporation. You were honored with the Urban Life Award at University of Akron on the same slate with Senator Kevin Coughlin, Dorothy Jackson, Deputy Mayor of Akron, County Executive Jim McCarthy. That's the company you are keeping. How did you get from that world to this world of the Arts?
Part of my involvement in the arts is based upon my upbringing and the early exposure I had to the Arts. I was born and raised in Philadelphia - an arts community. In Philadelphia, you would have to be blind to miss the murals or not see the affect that public art has on the city. I've always been exposed to the arts through my parents who had elementary school educations. We [our family] didn't always have money. There were many free arts events in Philadelphia to attend and we did that, but I also volunteered at the hospital where tickets to arts events were often made available; I hardly ever passed up one of those opportunities. My passion has always been the arts.

In 1998, after making my annual visit to the Philadelphia Fine Art Expo, I wondered what could I do in Cleveland to support the arts. The Philly Expo was in its 16th year at the time and had well over 40,000 visitors over that one weekend. I've been across the country to most of the major Ethnic Art Festivals and Expos, and also have been to many of this region's arts events. I said to myself what was up with Cleveland; there seemed to be not one venue that came close to giving the much needed exposure to the number of minority and ethnic artists in this region. There appeared to be nothing of any magnitude that supported ethnic fine arts.

I had often noticed that the ethnic artists, and thus the ethnic experience, were not well represented at the mainstream art shows. I thought, "You mean to tell me in this vibrant community there are no African American artists that could have been in these shows? What's up with that?" If you look at our [African American] history, we have never been perceived as master artists. Look at Jacob Lawrence, Romare Bearden and look at how long it took these artists to receive the recognition and acclaim from the majority arts community. Charles White, Aaron Douglas, and the like may never receive the significant acclaim they deserve, especially from the masses.

Could an arts agenda ever be part of a mission statement for say a CDC (Community Development Corporation)?
Oh absolutely! At the CDC level, it helps to foster the arts in a neighborhood. That is a quality of life issue. As far as business is concerned, the Rock and Roll guitars are a great example of the arts/business collaboration. It's a big step in the right direction for the City of Cleveland. All of these businesses have been willing to spend their money to support art - public art. We can grow the arts in Cleveland. However, we need to strategically continue to put plans together to increase the momentum of business involvement. I'm looking at this Budweiser poster [on the wall]. International companies have typically been great supporters of the arts. They have actually selected various artists to honor. There are other major companies, such as Progressive Insurance, that has money out front to support art/artist through major purchases. We have a partnership with other companies as well, like Joanne Stores. Other such partnerships like that can and should be developed.

Many people think that it is hard to connect with collectors. Is Sankofa finding collectors?
I think we are. Anecdotally, I hear it and see it all the time. Some collectors are well off and others are being groomed as they learn and are exposed to the world of art. You have to start somewhere. Being a collector may be second nature to people who have been exposed, but others are beginning to see the value of collecting art through the venues that are provided by Sankofa Fine Art Plus. We are thankful for the growth in this area.

I know that Sankofa's executive director] did a workshop on [collecting] prints; this is really a controversial area now because of new technology.
Here is where I get into trouble. The fact is, everyone cannot afford an original. If you are to grow and cultivate collectors they have to start somewhere. Collectors used to be a small elite segment of the public and...they had the education and the money.

So what I hear you saying is that part of the uproar goes beyond just the issue of the quality of an original vs. the quality of a 700/1000 lithograph. It speaks more to making art less elite and more accessible. That may be somewhat unpalatable to elitists.
As you say, Cav. Seriously, I do think that component does exist. Now, let's think about the artist. He or she can sell more prints and make more money than by only selling original art. Quite possibly the sales from the prints can then fuel the next original piece. We are doing our best to expose people to the arts. Many times we think that our values [concerning art] are the values that everyone ought to have. But art is personal. We showcase original art at our fine art venues. We have an original art pavilion as well as other artists with booths who are also selling their original art. The Art Expo is not the kind of champagne and caviar thing where all you are going to see is original art. Again, you have to grow this arts community and you have to help African Americans grow in particular to the point that they have the disposal income and appetite to appreciate fine art.

How long has Sankofa been around? How has it grown over the years?
Yes! This past February it was six years. I can't believe that! It has been five years for the Cleveland Fine Art Expo…and six years as an organization. But it's really tough when you are a small struggling arts organization like we are… We're not the museum. We're not MOCA. We are not SPACES. Add to that, we're primarily African American. That adds a whole other dimension to who we are. At the risk of sounding controversial, but not intending to alienate any one, especially potential funders, I will that this arts environment seems to cater to the needs of non-minorities. Of course, I am quite biased; it seems Sankofa does not receive the recognition for the value we bring to the community at large. While I am concerned about this issue, I am not focused on it, because it is what it is, and we are going to continue to do what we need to do to support our mission. We know what we do is valuable. It's of significant value to the African American community and as we continue to grow it will become increasingly clear to others.

I am thinking of the mural on 105th and Superior. Space and Flight that Jerome White did with kids through Yo! Cleveland - the mural changed that blighted corner into a great focal point. At the unveiling, NASA was very involved in the event along with a Tuskegee airmen; one of the greatest moments was seeing a young African American astronaut shake hands with one of the aimment and saying, "Thank you." And it all happened because Sankofa said, "Hey! Let's do a mural!"
How many of those children have ever really understood the impact and the contributions of Blacks in space and flight? We are trying to change that and again provide education and exposure to the community through specifically visual art.

How do you select artists for the Cleveland Fine Art Expo?
We have professionals involved. Some of our judges have included folks on a local level in the arts like, Jerome (White), Ted Sherron, and Ed Parker. We are also formalizing a panel of national artists that will be helping us to make decisions regarding the inclusion of artists from outside of Ohio. This will continue our efforts to add credibility as well as increase the participation of artists from across the country. We see this as an opportunity to bring people to Cleveland from the visitors and conventions side of the coin. It's clear that people of color want venues and opportunities where they can view and purchase fine ethnic art. Some of our largest purchasers this year were from outside of Ohio.

From where?
California. They came specifically for the Cleveland Fine Art Expo. People came from Baltimore, Chicago, Philadelphia and they bought art.

Why are people coming for this event?
Because we have made national connections. Look at our newspaper partner, Paint magazine. It circulates across the country. Look at where we are advertising. We are advertising nationally. Look at our connection with American Legacy magazine. We are beginning to be recognized as an organization that presents quality ethnic art and Cleveland is an area ripe for just that type of exposure.

Is that directly attributed to your business acumen and the world you came from melding into the arts? Most definitely. Large arts organizations do this, but many smaller ones need to learn how to do it. However, we would definitely like to see our numbers grow even greater… for a small arts organization that receives very little funding we have managed to pull in over 4,000 people annually to our expo.

How long is the Cleveland Fine Art Expo?
It is a weekend long event. I don't think that an attendance of 4,000 people is too shabby.

I think one thing you have to deal with more so than the larger community is our "come uppin's." Many times artistic bent is recognized but the message is, "Yeahhh, but let's think about a real job."
I have a young man who came in 2nd place in one of our youth art competition. His father is a well-respected businessman. He [the father] called me to thank me for Sankofa setting him straight so that he now knows one can make a living in the arts. We mentor the kids with working artists so they can see the possibilities. You take an artist like Charles Bibbs who is a serious, six-figure, contemporary artist who feels strongly that it is important to mentor and give back to support the effort to expose youth to the "business of art." Today, art is a business. That artist who doesn't recognize art as a business may find himself or herself not being able to make a decent living. Capacity building for artists is extremely important.

Woodrow Nash is another six-figure artist. Once you learn the business component as well as the artistic aspect of your business, there is an opportunity for you to do well. We offer workshops on that, too. If you don't have the ability to do capacity building to bring in the revenues, you can be an artist all day long but still starve if your art is just sitting up in the attic.

Is there a need for Sankofa to do artists' workshops? I mean CPAC (Community Partnership for Arts and Culture), the Foundation Center, Art House are all doing those kinds of workshops.
Yes, there is a need for us to do them as well. It might be a matter of perspective. We generally have a very mixed ethnic audience, people of color can look and say, "These people look just like me and they can do this." There is a need for us to put the information out there. We are always filled to capacity. If the word is spread and the education is offered, the Cleveland arts community will be better off.

This past Expo [May 21-23, 2004] was the first Cleveland Fine Art Expo that I haven't attended.
Do you remember us having lunch ages ago, when I first started the organization?

Yes, Yes. Talking about the fine arts and all of the different considerations… many of the same things that we are talking about today. I walked away from the meeting knowing that I was too much of an "art snob."
Interesting, because I do feel that many folks still don't view us as true connoisseurs of the arts. However, we continue to teach and expose and provide avenues for the not so mature as well as the mature art enthusiasts.

I have tried to make myself as available as possible to you. I have tried to never miss an opportunity to cross paths to see if I was changing or growing or whatever. I will say one thing that has sunk in over Sankofa's five years of Fine Art Expos is the idea of exposure. People are going to this event who are not going to other venues like the Cleveland Museum of Art, MOCA, etc.
If you had any idea how many people come up to me at the Expo and say, "Louise, I couldn't buy a piece of original art this year but I'm savin'. Next year, I am going to get a piece of original art." That is so great! Because prior to Sankofa, they didn't even know the difference. But as a community, a city, we still need to do more with the arts. I will give you an example of what I mean by that with an idea of our executive director. Donna initiated and expedited a mural tour in the City of Cleveland. We were very pleasantly surprised at the number of murals in the city and the number of people that showed up to take the mural tour! The interest is truly there.

My idea is collaboration, sharing resources and not recreating the wheel again.
We are the best organization in this city at what we do. We are small and still very young, and if we partner with too many arts organizations, it may hinder our ability to define ourselves. There are some things we have to clearly be out in front on, that are big, big issues for small organizations. Partnership is partially how we've survived over the past five years plus. We know the importance of collaboration and that dollars for the arts are very limited. We have and will continue to work in partnership and collaborate under the appropriate circumstances.

Let me change gears for a minute. How has being a woman in the business and art worlds affected you?
I don't spend a lot of energy on that. I pretty much know when I am being discriminated against. Do I choose to do anything about it? It just depends. I think women, particularly those of color, need to seriously contemplate our options and what is best for the greater good of the whole [of society]. Anymore it's not about letting someone get away with something. In my opinion, those companies or institutions that don't value diversity and don't value women are going to be left behind because they are missing out on a tremendous resource. They are not going to be able to serve the future consumers, which according to all of the statistics is going to be an even more diverse community. http://www.charityadvantage.com/sankofafineartplus/Home.asp

Interview and image by Cavana Faithwalker (:divend:)