From DoS to CV to GBV and Beyond:
Acronymically Yours with Doug Gillard

In 1999, Cleveland guitarist Doug Gillard was described by WFMU Music Director Brian Turner as "one of the Ohio 'lo-fi' scene's most hidden treasures." This was around the time Gillard was shedding the skin of his former Cleveland band, Cobra Verde, and becoming the main guitarist for Ohio's arguably greatest export, the sonically psychedelic rock-popsters known as Guided By Voices. A band of international acclaim and critical mystique, GBV, led by former Dayton school teacher and musical-poetry-machine Robert Pollard, have churned out albums for years. For the final eight years of the band's existence (Pollard announced that their latest recording, Half Smiles of the Decomposed, will be their last), Gillard has been the guitar to Pollard's voice, and the synergy has been wonderful.

But Gillard has explored music in more ways than his involvement in either Guided By Voices or Cobra Verde. In the Eighties, he was a member of Cleveland's ambitious Death of Samantha. He also had his own band, Gem, and released an EP as Malamute Jute in 1999. Gillard has also scored soundtracks for films for festivals for the last seven years, including a bossanova version of Gershwin's "A Foggy Day" that played as first runner-up at 2004's Vail Film Festival. And, for street cred props, there was his appearance in the Strokes' video, Someday. His latest endeavor is his first full-fledged, and fully realized solo album, Salamander, which is a delicious recording, and nicely sophisticated as rock records go, making Amazon.com's Top 10 Alternative albums of 2004.

Cool Cleveland: Congratulations on your first solo CD, Salamander. It has been out for several months now - I'm curious as to how you feel about the recording now that you have put some chronologic distance between it and you? Did it turned out as you planned? Are you satisfied with the sound quality and your musicianship and singing?
Doug Gillard: Thanks. I feel pretty good about it. I put tons of work and my own dough into it, and it seems to be getting received pretty well. Yes, it turned out as I planned, but, as I was recording the songs, I didn't have a sequence in mind until they were all finished. I anguished over that one for some time. I started recording it sometime on later 2003, finished in 2004, and it came out officially in October. Out of respect for GBV, (and also time), I wasn't going to tour on it until the band was done, so now, Salamander has a second life as I play shows supporting it.

The announcement that GBV was ending came as I was almost done recording the record anyway, so it wasn't like I rushed to get a solo lp out after learning of the band ending. It was already underway anyway. As for the other question, yes, I'm satisfied with the playing....not so much the singing all the time, but I did my best on 90% of the songs. There are a couple I wish I'd gone in and punched in better vocals on, but, overall, it's not bad. I don't have the strongest voice in the world, so, it actually turned out better than I'd expected.

It doesn't really matter in the scheme of Rock & Roll, how well a recording sells, but have the sales been brisk so far? I imagine you're selling a fair share of discs at Guided By Voices shows, especially since this is the final tour?
I'm not sure at all how sales are. I think it needs to be a lot more visible, although being distributed by Redeye is a big help in itself. I sold a few at the gbv shows, but, understandably, I wouldnt expect these fans to want to spend any more money than they already have on us after paying for tickets to our shows, and also keeping up with all the records they buy of ours and related projects. It's been fine. It's also available on iTunes, so I have no idea how it is selling.

By the way, is this truly the final tour for the venerable institution from Dayton, Ohio?
Yes. The announcement was the first official one announcing the end of the band (as opposed to it just happening in the past without fanfare), and we're not going to go back on our word with regard to that.

What's the significance of the title, Salamander?
I felt a connection to the meaning of the word, and to the characteristics of a salamander. A salamander is fabled to possess the ability to withstand fire, or to live in fire. After making the record, I felt like that was a metaphor to my experience over the last couple years. And when my mother passed away about a year ago, a pipe burst in my place, flooding a lot of things; everything was uprooted for a while and whole rooms had to be rebuilt. It also lives on land and in water, and I wrote some of these songs in my house, which is right on the lake...so, I just liked the word a lot. I'm not the lizard king, though.

A lot of musicians, and I'm not going to qualify that with "drummers" or "guitarists" or whatever, would just give about anything to be in a successful rock band, let alone one of international Indie repute like GBV. Yet here you are, playing guitar with Mr. Pollard's band, and before that you've played in Gem and Cobra Verde and Death of Samantha. AND on top of all that, you have your own CD out in the marketplace and being played on radio stations, etc. Are there days when you still have to pinch yourself to make sure you're awake and not dreaming such a fine time of things? Is it somehow a surreal experience for you in the end?
No. No. But I certainly don't feel too lucky or surreal. I am glad, however, that everything I've been involved with, such as Gem, Cobra Verde, and DoS had integrity, even though few people are even aware of those projects. But I'm proud of my involvement in them, and also to have had the experience in Guided By Voices. Everything I've experienced or been asked to play in, I feel I have earned; it was because I did the work to get there, not just because I was somebody's acquaintance.

I really like Salamander; there are some great guitar textures on the release, and some sweet guitar hooks and musicianship. And you have a very emotive, strong voice. You played just about all the instruments on the disc, aside from the drums on a few tracks and also the violins. Was that to make some sort of statement about your prowess as a musician, or was it financially motivated? What was your motivating factor for truly recording a "solo" solo album?
Thanks, Daiv. No, I would never play everything myself just for "the credits", or to prove, as you say, my prowess as a musician. I do that only because I know what I am going for, and can usually execute it, although, I'm starting to have doubts about the future of my drumming ability. On my records, I'd rather play all the guitars and bass, and in this case most of the drums, and have the parts that I hear be exactly that, than try to explain them to guys, and the parts end up being only a fraction of what I envisioned. And actually, it costs more to do it this way, as opposed to using a rhythm section to record with. But I seem to work better just doing it myself, rather than risking someone I respect feeling insulted or bossed around by me trying to tell them what to play. Having said that, I think I'll use a rhythm section next time. Screw all this extra work!

I was a little disappointed that Pollard didn't contribute a backing vocal or something somewhere. You know, a cameo appearance? Is he just not into that kind of thing, or would that be some form of contractual obligation to Matador he needs to oblige, or were you just not into a GBV influence THAT obvious on the album?
I didn't ask him to. He probably would have. I live up here in Cleveland, and he's in Dayton. I also didn't see it fitting in anywhere. I don't get asked to play on his solo lps either.

Speaking of Robert Pollard, he seems like such a wondrous creative fountain at times, but then he's also got that dark side as well. Could you talk a little bit about how your perception of him has changed--from when you first started playing with GBV until now, this final tour? What have you learned from playing and performing with him?
I've learned a lot from Bob, and the biggest thing is some of the formations and techniques he uses on guitar. He's really a great guitarist, and he writes all his tunes on a guitar. So, for every lp we go in to record, I have to learn his parts. Also for old songs released before I joined, I'd have to learn those too, and it was a lot of fun. He uses very unorthodox chords and parts of chords, drone strings and the like.

I also learned a sense of timing on stage. More precisely, I would learn to "pad" a chord/note sequence with an extra strum, or subtract from it, if a vocal line was missed, or late, or early, etc...especially if it was a song that was just he and I playing -- and there were a lot of those.

Do you guys in the band all have nicknames for each other? Come on, you can tell us...a Cool Cleveland exclusive!
Sorry, we don't. Pretty boring sounding, I know. I do know that Kevin March was "Kevvy-Kev", Jim MacPherson was "Hillbilly Boy", and our most recent bassist was dubbed "bladder boy.. Other than that, I don't know. If there was one for me, and there may have been, it certainly wasn't said to my face. Maybe I was just "asshole" or something. I cant speak to the lineups before me; maybe they had some of their own.

On your song 'Fate, Say It Again,' you sing about how you "nearly drank myself out of my muse." I imagine it must be really difficult to hold fast to the center, borrowing a Taoist concept, and retain your creative vision and your excellence as a musician and a songwriter, with so much opportunity for Bacchanalian reverie and such legendary partyers being your associates. Have you found yourself "on more than one occasion" just totally and completely swept up in the stereotypical Rock and Roll lifestyle thing? How have you maintained balance, because Salamander definitely feels like a recording from a balanced guy?
Balanced?! To answer the first question: Oh, hell, yeah. I've wasted so many opportunities for not only creating; just everyday responsibilities because of being hungover, or i was just having too much fun drinking that I blew off something, etc...It's not because of my former band at all -- that's just in me, anyway. There have also been other things associated with that "rock and roll lifestyle thing" that I've indulged in and they have taken their toll, or just remained fun memories, or whatever. But anyway, I can't say that I feel necessarily too balanced all the time. I'm also lazy. That doesn't help.

To come up with lyrics, I usually have to work at it, or focus on it. They dont come easily to me, like they do some other people. But music and melody can come to me immediately about 80% of the time. Or, i'll start playing, and have a riff or chord pattern usually within a minute or so. No matter what state I'm in. I don't do anything to maintain balance. Sometimes a day of mind-numbing TV, or, as is the case now, the SCTV vol 2 box set, will sort of set me right, in the midst of all activity and responsibilities.

The CD is on Pink Frost Records, which is of course affiliated with Jack Rabid and The Big Takeover magazine. That guy is industrious and very knowledgeable and has been involved with Punk Rock etc. in Manhattan since it began. He's cool, too. How did it come about that you recorded for his label? Were there others you considered? I imagine there were other labels that considered you?
I had had a meeting with people from Yep Roc records/ Redeye dist. in NC to see if they'd be interestd in the project, and they loved it, but had a too-full roster, so they let me know that Jack, whom I already knew, was starting a label. I sent him a disc, and he liked it.

I really didn't send too many out at all, if any. It's always humiliating to get a no-answerback or a rejection card from new indies run by guys who you" have chunks of in your stool", to quote Phil Hartman, so, I hate sending unsigned records out to the smarmy indie label folks.

Jack is a very earnest music fan, and he's enthusiastic about what he does, and what he writes about in his magazine. He doesnt have some affected apathy, and what I've noticed about his magazine is that it's largely devoid of the all-too-common snarkiness and smarm that has come to be the state of the art in "rock criticism", and moreover, Indie-rock writing.

"Momma" is a very poignant tune, "Blockout" is perfectly trippy in a folk-rock way, and "Give Me Something" rocks point-blank very crisply. Were there some tracks that you did not include on Salamander because you could not get them right somehow, and maybe we'll see those songs five CDs from now on some kind of rarities release? Are you one of those musicians/songwriters that will work and re-work a song structure over and over again in the studio until it sounds just right, or do you enjoy the spontaneous surprises along the way that cause the recordings to be pleasantly "different" than you anticipated?
Thanks for the compliments. There are no leftovers from this record, but I have tons of songs waiting in the wings I need to record. In the studio, I usually know what the structure's going to be, but if I re-work it, it's at home on idea tapes or whatever. Yes, I do enjoy the spontaneous surprises along the way in recording. And believe me, whenever I sing or play drums, there are gonna be some surprises! I hate pristine sounding recordings, and especially really cliche' or typical drum fills (listen to any modern country station) and snares or hi-hats that are too crisp, or tuned too tight. There was one song that I wanted to abandon, but I ended up doing things to it that made it more palatable to me, and now it's one of my favorites on the record! With "Landmarks (in my mind)", I wasn't liking the sound of the vocals, and I also thought a part of it was too unintentionally dave matthews-y, god forbid, so I had a major problem with that. Then I put a more psychedelic electric guitar track on it, and also put the vocals thru some flanging and fucked-up effects so it sounded cooler. Turns out, that's just what it needed.

Are you still a Cleveland resident, and if so, I'm wondering what live acts you've been able to check out and enjoy the past few years?
Yes, I am still in Cleveland. I haven't been home enough to check out local acts much at all. Brian Straw is great to see, and the All Golden are a great band from here, too. Sputnik have a good recording. I just played a set with Scott Krauss and Tony Maimone at the Beachland, doing old Ubu stuff, and I also check out great things that come thru town there, like last year I saw my old pal Chris Brokaw, the Dead Boys reunion, just saw Neko Case, and I caught a weird bill with Steve Wynn opening for Glenn Tilbrook. They were both great, and Tilbrook and his band played every Squeeze song imagineable, while vocally never hitting a sour note,m and really playing some amazing lead guitar. You know, there are guys like him and Marshall Crenshaw and Paul Mc Cartney? who are known as singers and songwriters, but their gutar playing gets overlooked.

What's your take on Cleveland, anyhow? I guess I mean, from a music or cultural point of view...so many folks are just so down about things here and you've had the opportunity to travel to many far and fabled locations. What can you tell Cleveland about herself that perhaps she has forgotten, or needs to hear? And this is not the time to be politically correct either; let us have it!
"Herself"? Well, I guess Cleveland used to seem like a female until they put up the Key Tower. But seriously, Daiv, yeah, I like Cleveland because it is home, but what I would want to tell it, as any town, really, is that when I am in any other city, big or small, they are not talking about what's going on in Cleveland, or concerned about the feuds within the Scene, PD, or Free Times -- another town's "scene" is not given one shit about anywhere else, and no one's ever going to hear about it, so, lighten up, I guess, is what I would say. Think globally, or at least, nationally.

The weather here is getting hard to take, but Ive been used to it all my life, and the neighborhood outside where I live is officially changing its name to the area of Crackton, but, the cost of living here is so cheap, and there is space here. You can pull up to someone's house or apartment and actually practice there, and not pay rent on it. There are parking spaces a plenty here. The problem is, the media ain't here, if you are looking to get somewhere as an artist or in music. You really have to tour, or relocate. But Cleveland has got great college radio, and WCPN's great. I know I'm addressing the musical side of the coin here rather than the big picture, but I'm talking about what I know. Okay, here's something I would tell the city in general - stop voting down school levies and other small taxes, and, let's have our police and firemen back. Hollie Strano for mayor!

I saw an absolutely pathetic VH 1? program where they were "remaking" Vince Neil of Motley Crue. You know, getting him to lose weight and work-out and cut his hair and get a new wardrobe and stop drinking and even undergo plastic surgery, and then sing a new song that was written for him by Desmond Childe. You know Doug, there are a lot more worthy candidates for that kind of resurrection than Vince Neil! Anyways, my question is, you're not going to go that sad-sack road that Vince Neil rolled down, but how do you keep the boy on the farm once he's been to Ol' Paris? What's next for you, big-picture-wise, after being in a super-cool band and then recording your own CD? How does one find contentment post GBV, etc?
Well, unfortunately, VH 1? can't remake Hanoi Rock's drummer Razzle, who Vince killed years ago. That would be under the category "Really Extreme Makeover." I remember when Motley Crue's first lp was sort of peddled more in the punk marketplace, as metal was in a nebulous place in the early '80s, and hadn't solidified into certain factions yet, e.g. hair metal, metal (meaning Metallica, etc.), and hardcore/metal. The Crue's look then was pretty cool - streamlined, and lots of new wave makeup Then they got more mainstream, and didn't look as cool. Why is he doing a song by Norma Desmond's Child?

Anyways, to answer the actual question, it's quite easy to find contentment post-Guided By Voices. I am going to support Salamander and I've been working on a film project as of early January called Donnybrook; it's tied in with Tri-C. They are producing their first feature-length and want to attract students to a soon-to-come, hands-on filmmaking class they're starting and I'm doing some of the music for it. There will also be more films other people I know who will have me do the score for them; and I'll eventually want to record another CD. I've got a lot I need to do, like develop my website more: http://www.douggillard.com and write more songs, get a real job, and try to support the record.

Interview by Daiv Whaley daivw@yahoo.com

Photo by Ana Luisa Morales

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